I was reading another forum about new instructors who have binders of notes for briefings and ground work. Charts, training aids...power point presentations...so much
But I have never seen, not once, an instructor actually referring to them. And using only a very simple training aid occasionally.
I have also seen instructors finish a post flight briefing, then literally start with the next student without even looking at a PTR.
Which makes me wonder about all these binders of notes made while working on a class 4.
It was many years ago (decades);since I got an instructor rating, but we used very few aids. . And my notes were pretty much nil. The aids we did use continued to be used when we were actually instructing. That being said I don’t recall an examiner every setting a quota on how many questions I needed to ask in briefing, or how many times to bring up adverse yaw. It mystifies me, this one size fits all formula instructing.
And we taught pretty much exactly the same things that are taught today...
In a lot fewer hours.
Anybody else notice this or have I simply missed something?
Instructor prep and observations
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What has changed about flying that has driven the hours up so much compared to when we learned to fly?And we taught pretty much exactly the same things that are taught today...
In a lot fewer hours.
When I got my private pilot license the course had a minimum of thirty hours and a lot of us finished in thirty hours.
Also we learned on tail wheel airplanes , so it can't be the airplanes.
A quick Google search brought this up on the Victoria flying club web site.
That is over twice the time we took.While it is possible to achieve the Private Pilot Licence within the minimums the national student average is between 65 to 75 hours.
- Colonel
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- Location: Over The Runway
In Canada, IIRC according to TC there is:
Ground School
Prep Ground Instruction (PGI)
Pre-Flight Briefing
In-Flight Instruction
Post-Flight Briefing
Oddly there is no requirement to take the ground school first. It is not the responsibility
of the flight instructor to teach it, either.
PGI is what most new flight instructors struggle with. The common error is to try not
to forget anything, so they end up presenting a blur of 927 facts with 191 pages of
instructional material per lesson, none of which the student is going to remember.
PGI need to be focussed and minimal. When I was a class one, I would tell new class
four instructors that they were allowed ONE page for PGI (ok, both sides for really hard
lessons) and it should look like this:
will see, sit down and shut up.
Hold an airplane in your hand, showing WHAT it will do. Visual learning is really important.
Break complicated exercises into smaller blocks, and ask questions at the end
of each block.
I like to think that I taught some pretty good instructors in Canada, even if TC
thinks I don't have sufficient virtue to be there any more. You know some of them.
Ground School
Prep Ground Instruction (PGI)
Pre-Flight Briefing
In-Flight Instruction
Post-Flight Briefing
Oddly there is no requirement to take the ground school first. It is not the responsibility
of the flight instructor to teach it, either.
PGI is what most new flight instructors struggle with. The common error is to try not
to forget anything, so they end up presenting a blur of 927 facts with 191 pages of
instructional material per lesson, none of which the student is going to remember.
PGI need to be focussed and minimal. When I was a class one, I would tell new class
four instructors that they were allowed ONE page for PGI (ok, both sides for really hard
lessons) and it should look like this:
and that's it. If you're not telling a student HOW to do the exercise, or WHAT heHow To Construct Good PGI For An Exercise
TKT:
mental & physical condition
assess knowledge of exercise
WHAT:
developmentally draw out from student’s assigned reading
MOTIVATION:
why learn exercise? How fit into training?
HOW:
using whiteboard drawing and aircraft model, explain to student:
o what aircraft will do
o what flight and engine control inputs are required to make airplane do that
o what he will see
o break complicated tasks down into simpler tasks
o tell him what we’re going to do, and ask him to tell us
o QUESTIONS at end of each section, to confirm knowledge and involve
o NO THEORY – don’t confuse groundschool with PGI
COMMON ERRORS:
everyone makes the same mistakes – head start
SAFETY:
particular to exercise: lookout, altitude, botched recovery, G limits, etc.
will see, sit down and shut up.
Hold an airplane in your hand, showing WHAT it will do. Visual learning is really important.
Break complicated exercises into smaller blocks, and ask questions at the end
of each block.
I like to think that I taught some pretty good instructors in Canada, even if TC
thinks I don't have sufficient virtue to be there any more. You know some of them.
45 / 47 => 95 3/4%
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Some years ago I decided to renew my flight instructors rating.
When I went to T.C. to get the process started the first thing I was told by the T.C. inspector that it was going to be very difficult for me to renew it because I had to many preconceived ideas on the subject.
I was quite stunned at his attitude so I just sat there for a moment until I could form an answer.
Finally I stood up and said thanks for helping me save a lot of time and money, and if I decided to change my mind first I would have to get a lobotomy so I could be a moron just like him.
He didn't know what to say and I told him it was better not to comment.
I got up and walked out of the pricks office feeling real happy that I would not be dealing with that mindset.
I have never regretted that decision.
When I went to T.C. to get the process started the first thing I was told by the T.C. inspector that it was going to be very difficult for me to renew it because I had to many preconceived ideas on the subject.
I was quite stunned at his attitude so I just sat there for a moment until I could form an answer.
Finally I stood up and said thanks for helping me save a lot of time and money, and if I decided to change my mind first I would have to get a lobotomy so I could be a moron just like him.
He didn't know what to say and I told him it was better not to comment.
I got up and walked out of the pricks office feeling real happy that I would not be dealing with that mindset.
I have never regretted that decision.
- Colonel
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- Location: Over The Runway
Welcome to the club. I was told it was not going to be "productive" for me to pursueI was told by the T.C. inspector that it was going to be very difficult for me to renew
a renewal of either my class one or class one aerobatic instructor ratings in Ontario Region.
So, for many years I did my instructor rating renewals elsewhere in Canada, in other Regions.
Did my medical in Quebec Region, to steer clear of that threat as well.
Had to fly an ICAS ACE up from Florida every year. Lots of extra taxation, essentially.
I thought it was extremely unprofessional of them to blacklist me, but no one gave a
shit what I thought. They just wanted me out of aviation - better yet, out of the country.
I would be fascinated where in the Aeronautics Act that the Minister is empowered to
disenfranchise pilots with perfect lifetime safety records, that are disliked by the bureaucracy.
45 / 47 => 95 3/4%
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When I was flying in Europe I did the European unrestricted flight display license for airshow flying.
It required yearly renewal with a full ground and flight test.
They were great people to deal with and I always learned something new from the renewals.
It required yearly renewal with a full ground and flight test.
They were great people to deal with and I always learned something new from the renewals.
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- Joined: Thu Jan 23, 2020 4:25 pm
Same here, so I went to Europe and never ever looked back.They just wanted me out of aviation - better yet, out of the country.
They are a self proclaimed power structure that is protected by their higher up bureaucracy and to be part of said bureaucracy you must be a moral degenerate.I would be fascinated where in the Aeronautics Act that the Minister is empowered to
disenfranchise pilots that are disliked by the bureaucracy.
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By the way when I was forced out of Canada I sued the co.k.uckers for denying me due process under law in Canada.
It took three and a half years to win my case and I was awarded a $250,000 settlement for my losses.
And a few of their higher up managers lost their positions for their actions.
It took three and a half years to win my case and I was awarded a $250,000 settlement for my losses.
And a few of their higher up managers lost their positions for their actions.
- Scudrunner
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- Contact:
Funny enough I came across this post on Alberta General Aviation FB group
Sounded like a cheap way to promote themselves on a FB group to get some clients or virtue signalling of some sort but I had a laugh at some of it such as “not teaching how to fly into controlled airspace “
But the funniest to me was
Always comes down to who the instructor is and the student. Some guys show up prepped and ready to go others want it spoon fed to them $50 bucks and hour at a time.
A gentle word of warning to anyone using freelance instructors. (Of which I am one so, yes I understand the irony). I’ve come across 4 students (CPL, instructor, and PPL) in the last 6 months who’ve used freelance instructors in Alberta and the stories about their instructors are mind boggling. ALL classes of freelancers.
Stories from “wouldn’t teach me to fly into controlled airspace” to “did the lesson prep by waving their hand toward the book and saying don’t worry you’ll figure it out in the airplane” to saying “this is how you have to Learn for the flight test but in real life it’s different “ !!!
Freelancers have a bad rep for being unorganized, lacking proper materials and syllabi, and deviating so far from standard as to be unrecognizable. And it turns out that some in our area are living up to the bad name.
I have a checklist for any students who want to put a litmus test to their instructor. No names I don’t collect data or information. I just wanted to help students be more informed. Send me a PM and I’ll send you the checklist to see if you’re getting good quality from your freelance instructor.
Sounded like a cheap way to promote themselves on a FB group to get some clients or virtue signalling of some sort but I had a laugh at some of it such as “not teaching how to fly into controlled airspace “
But the funniest to me was
Uh ya sorry to knock you off your soap box, but yes there is a lot of that in aviation and in reality every profession.“this is how you have to Learn for the flight test but in real life it’s different “ !!!
Always comes down to who the instructor is and the student. Some guys show up prepped and ready to go others want it spoon fed to them $50 bucks and hour at a time.
5 out of 2 Pilots are Dyslexic.
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Andrew: in concert with your description of a pre-flight briefing, I still remember the one used in the military - one which your father would have used if he instructed in the military. (Can't remember if you said he did so)
Anyway:
AMOL
Aim
Motivation
Outline
Link
Pocket
Pause
Basically what you said, but in "old speak"...
When I came back from Germany in '63, I was posted to Portage as a T-33 instructor. A requirement prior to starting the instructor course was attendance at the "School of Instructional Technique". It was a short course (3 weeks - 4 weeks, can't remember) that introduced you to - and had you practice - mass briefings (classroom) and pre-flight briefings (briefing room style). Turned out to be one of the best courses I ever took - had many applications outside the military setting.
Following that, it was off to FIS (Flying Instructors School) at Portage where all the information gathered on the SIT course was put into action. All candidates gave practice mass briefings to their peers which was ruthlessly critiqued by same and staff instructors. Practice "pre-flight briefings" were simulated by one of your 'buddies' acting as the student. Again, it was ruthless critiqued by both student body and staff.
You learned pretty quickly not to BS (Duff Gen!) and that you had to become an SME - a subject matter expert. If you don't know the material, don't try and bluff your way through it...
Your delineation is very familiar; don't know what they call it now, but I recognize the flow.
Ground School
Prep Ground Instruction (PGI)
Pre-Flight Briefing
In-Flight Instruction
Post-Flight Briefing
etc
Anyway:
AMOL
Aim
Motivation
Outline
Link
Pause
Basically what you said, but in "old speak"...
When I came back from Germany in '63, I was posted to Portage as a T-33 instructor. A requirement prior to starting the instructor course was attendance at the "School of Instructional Technique". It was a short course (3 weeks - 4 weeks, can't remember) that introduced you to - and had you practice - mass briefings (classroom) and pre-flight briefings (briefing room style). Turned out to be one of the best courses I ever took - had many applications outside the military setting.
Following that, it was off to FIS (Flying Instructors School) at Portage where all the information gathered on the SIT course was put into action. All candidates gave practice mass briefings to their peers which was ruthlessly critiqued by same and staff instructors. Practice "pre-flight briefings" were simulated by one of your 'buddies' acting as the student. Again, it was ruthless critiqued by both student body and staff.
You learned pretty quickly not to BS (Duff Gen!) and that you had to become an SME - a subject matter expert. If you don't know the material, don't try and bluff your way through it...
Your delineation is very familiar; don't know what they call it now, but I recognize the flow.
Ground School
Prep Ground Instruction (PGI)
Pre-Flight Briefing
In-Flight Instruction
Post-Flight Briefing
etc
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