Landings.
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I like three pointers right now because they are changing, it allows me to slow the plane down and I need the practice.
- Colonel
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- Joined: Wed Jan 15, 2020 10:02 pm
- Location: Over The Runway
There is more than just a wheelie and the three-pointer.
The very best landing in a taildragger may very well be tailwheel first.
BD Maule recommended it, as does the POH for the S-2B.
If one were to actually operate an aircraft IAW the AFM/POH (gasp):
Notice at 0:21 I put the tailwheel down first. When this occurs, the mains come
down and that decreases your AOA and decreases your lift. The landing is over,
then.
It is worthwhile to note that this three point landing resulted from my usual 180 mph
approach, slowing to 120 mph before touchdown. That is a recipe which works well
for formation landings, at least it does for me.
Note that while three point landings (or tailwheel first landings) are fine for little
taildraggers, they are less and less likely to be your first choice as the weight of
the aircraft increases.
For example, while you could probably three-point the Beech 18, I actually never
did. Every landing was a wheelie. I suspect very few people have three-pointed
a DC-3 or C-46 recently, and you would have to look pretty hard to find anyone
that ever landed a B-17 or Lancaster tailwheel first.
EDIT
The note in the POH about not over-controlling is really important. I had a student
placard his Pitts S1 after some dual with me thusly:
Land a taildragger perfectly aligned with it's direction of travel. If the landing gear
isn't bent from a previous undocumented groundloop, it will continue to travel straight
in the absence of an input. From you. From the wind.
Do a compression test sometime. 80 psi in the cylinder, and you can take your hands
off the prop at TDC. It's going to stay there, isn't it? Now, you move it ONE degree,
and off it goes, with tremendous torque.
Same thing as landing a taildragger. Land it straight, and don't do anything.
Less is more. Fast hands (and feet) in the cockpit scare the living shit out of me.
The very best landing in a taildragger may very well be tailwheel first.
BD Maule recommended it, as does the POH for the S-2B.
If one were to actually operate an aircraft IAW the AFM/POH (gasp):
Notice at 0:21 I put the tailwheel down first. When this occurs, the mains come
down and that decreases your AOA and decreases your lift. The landing is over,
then.
It is worthwhile to note that this three point landing resulted from my usual 180 mph
approach, slowing to 120 mph before touchdown. That is a recipe which works well
for formation landings, at least it does for me.
Note that while three point landings (or tailwheel first landings) are fine for little
taildraggers, they are less and less likely to be your first choice as the weight of
the aircraft increases.
For example, while you could probably three-point the Beech 18, I actually never
did. Every landing was a wheelie. I suspect very few people have three-pointed
a DC-3 or C-46 recently, and you would have to look pretty hard to find anyone
that ever landed a B-17 or Lancaster tailwheel first.
EDIT
The note in the POH about not over-controlling is really important. I had a student
placard his Pitts S1 after some dual with me thusly:
Land a taildragger perfectly aligned with it's direction of travel. If the landing gear
isn't bent from a previous undocumented groundloop, it will continue to travel straight
in the absence of an input. From you. From the wind.
Do a compression test sometime. 80 psi in the cylinder, and you can take your hands
off the prop at TDC. It's going to stay there, isn't it? Now, you move it ONE degree,
and off it goes, with tremendous torque.
Same thing as landing a taildragger. Land it straight, and don't do anything.
Less is more. Fast hands (and feet) in the cockpit scare the living shit out of me.
45 / 47 => 95 3/4%
- Colonel
- Posts: 2554
- Joined: Wed Jan 15, 2020 10:02 pm
- Location: Over The Runway
Too Much Verbiage Dept
What I learned, from a quarter century of sitting in the right seat and
watching people teach themselves to fly ....
... is that sometimes, people get behind the airplane.
For example, on short final, a pilot landing a taildragger gets behind
and instead of a nice slow, gradual flare, he flares in a hell of a hurry.
And, he pulls it off. He levels off beautifully 6 inches above the runway.
But there's a problem. Gyroscopic precession in the rapid flare has
yawed the aircraft right a few degrees, and we touch down in a crab,
and off we go to the right side of the runway. The pilot applies a boot
full of left rudder, and we careen across the centerline, with more of
an angle to the left, than we originally had to the right. Can you say,
Divergent Oscillation, boys and girls?
Sigh. Do you have any idea how many thousands of times, I have
seen that happen? But you can't tell a pilot, hey, think faster. Don't
get behind the aircraft. He's pedalling as fast as he can, and he
doesn't need you to shit on him, too.
But. Please don't touch a taildragger down unless you have no crab.
This is very simple, but oddly, this crucial information is guarded
like the crown jewels by the flight training industry, which I am no
longer a part of, so I'm allowed to mention it.
What I learned, from a quarter century of sitting in the right seat and
watching people teach themselves to fly ....
... is that sometimes, people get behind the airplane.
For example, on short final, a pilot landing a taildragger gets behind
and instead of a nice slow, gradual flare, he flares in a hell of a hurry.
And, he pulls it off. He levels off beautifully 6 inches above the runway.
But there's a problem. Gyroscopic precession in the rapid flare has
yawed the aircraft right a few degrees, and we touch down in a crab,
and off we go to the right side of the runway. The pilot applies a boot
full of left rudder, and we careen across the centerline, with more of
an angle to the left, than we originally had to the right. Can you say,
Divergent Oscillation, boys and girls?
Sigh. Do you have any idea how many thousands of times, I have
seen that happen? But you can't tell a pilot, hey, think faster. Don't
get behind the aircraft. He's pedalling as fast as he can, and he
doesn't need you to shit on him, too.
But. Please don't touch a taildragger down unless you have no crab.
This is very simple, but oddly, this crucial information is guarded
like the crown jewels by the flight training industry, which I am no
longer a part of, so I'm allowed to mention it.
45 / 47 => 95 3/4%
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- Joined: Thu Jan 23, 2020 4:25 pm
How can someone guard something they are not aware of?This is very simple, but oddly, this crucial information is guarded
like the crown jewels by the flight training industry,
-
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- Joined: Wed Apr 28, 2021 7:21 pm
- Location: Group W Bench
I would tend to agree with that. That’s information long lost in most corners of flight training. It’s hiding in plain sight though. Flying airplanes just ain’t rocket surgery.Chuck Ellsworth wrote: ↑Wed Jun 30, 2021 8:32 pmHow can someone guard something they are not aware of?This is very simple, but oddly, this crucial information is guarded
like the crown jewels by the flight training industry,
The details of my life are quite inconsequential...
- Colonel
- Posts: 2554
- Joined: Wed Jan 15, 2020 10:02 pm
- Location: Over The Runway
This isn't very complicated ....
A dry pavement runway is actually the worst possible surface for a taildragger.
The less friction, the better. This allows landing a taildragger with a crab.
Actually, with a 100% ice-covered runway, land the taildragger in a crab. Same
as with a nosedragger. You're going to end up there anyways if there's a crosswind
so why bother with the whole drop-a-wing-straighten-out-for-touchdown?
The most entertaining surface to land on, is a runway which is 50% ice-covered
(bonus points for melting in the sun, giving water on top of ice) and 50% bare and
dry. With a howling crosswind, you just can't win. You're going to weathervane
into a crab after touchdown on the ice, then the tires will shriek when you hit the
dry pavement. A nosedragger will straighten itself out, but you're in for a fun time
in a crab on dry pavement in a taildragger.
Back when I lived in Canada, you had to watch out for the taildragger guys that
flew off grass - and were used to landing with a little crab - then would (try to)
land on dry pavement, where they were in for a rude awakening.
That's exactly what that guy did. Flipped it upside down in front of the air
cadets, who were right on the edge of the runway. They picked it up and
carried it off, and as the airport operator I had to phone up the TSB and
apologize for them.
Dry pavement is terribly unforgiving for taildraggers. This is two instructors
in a biplane.
Here's a PPL on grass:
and just so that I'm not picking on any group, here's a fighter pilot who tried to fly with only one engine:
and here's another fighter pilot that tried to do arithmetic for top gate in his head:
Incredibly he was promoted after that. Several times, if memory serves.
Some memorable landings, there.
A dry pavement runway is actually the worst possible surface for a taildragger.
The less friction, the better. This allows landing a taildragger with a crab.
Actually, with a 100% ice-covered runway, land the taildragger in a crab. Same
as with a nosedragger. You're going to end up there anyways if there's a crosswind
so why bother with the whole drop-a-wing-straighten-out-for-touchdown?
The most entertaining surface to land on, is a runway which is 50% ice-covered
(bonus points for melting in the sun, giving water on top of ice) and 50% bare and
dry. With a howling crosswind, you just can't win. You're going to weathervane
into a crab after touchdown on the ice, then the tires will shriek when you hit the
dry pavement. A nosedragger will straighten itself out, but you're in for a fun time
in a crab on dry pavement in a taildragger.
Back when I lived in Canada, you had to watch out for the taildragger guys that
flew off grass - and were used to landing with a little crab - then would (try to)
land on dry pavement, where they were in for a rude awakening.
That's exactly what that guy did. Flipped it upside down in front of the air
cadets, who were right on the edge of the runway. They picked it up and
carried it off, and as the airport operator I had to phone up the TSB and
apologize for them.
Dry pavement is terribly unforgiving for taildraggers. This is two instructors
in a biplane.
Here's a PPL on grass:
and just so that I'm not picking on any group, here's a fighter pilot who tried to fly with only one engine:
and here's another fighter pilot that tried to do arithmetic for top gate in his head:
Incredibly he was promoted after that. Several times, if memory serves.
Some memorable landings, there.
45 / 47 => 95 3/4%
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- Joined: Thu Jan 16, 2020 3:24 am
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