[quote]Hence maybe trim?[/quote]
If the trim was set at full nose up the pilot handling should have rejected the take off, it would have been obvious it it was left full nose up.
Even more important is it is part of the pre take off checklist.
The DC3 is one of the easiest to fly airplanes I ever flew and I have over five thousand hours on them with a lot of it off airport wheel-ski operations.
Crashing one on take off from a paved runway is really hard to do.
DC-3 MISHAP
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Colonel
- Posts: 3450
- Joined: Wed Apr 29, 2015 10:31 am
Only thing I can think of, is severely aft C of G. Especially
if the load shifted aft when the throttles went forward?
In that case, pulling both throttles would have been the only
choice. You do [b]NOT[/b] want to go flying with the C of G that far
back.
[youtube][/youtube]
I don't [i]think[/i] this is the case here - I saw no violent nose pitchup
as soon as it was airborne, which is what you would expect with a
severely aft C of G.
No, there was something terribly wrong in the cockpit of that DC-3.
LOWER THE NOSE.
if the load shifted aft when the throttles went forward?
In that case, pulling both throttles would have been the only
choice. You do [b]NOT[/b] want to go flying with the C of G that far
back.
[youtube][/youtube]
I don't [i]think[/i] this is the case here - I saw no violent nose pitchup
as soon as it was airborne, which is what you would expect with a
severely aft C of G.
No, there was something terribly wrong in the cockpit of that DC-3.
LOWER THE NOSE.
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Eric Janson
- Posts: 412
- Joined: Tue Jul 14, 2015 10:31 am
The video of the crash aftermath shows the elevator sitting in the neutral position.
It should be hanging down. There's a close up on PPRuNe that appears to show some kind of plate holding the elevator in place.
Hard to believe anyone would attempt a take-off with the controls locked - flight control check is flying 101. It has happened before.
Pilots sometimes think that because they fly large jets they can fly something like this too - it's actually the other way round!These older aircraft require knowledge and skill to operate safely - they bite very hard as these people found out.
It should be hanging down. There's a close up on PPRuNe that appears to show some kind of plate holding the elevator in place.
Hard to believe anyone would attempt a take-off with the controls locked - flight control check is flying 101. It has happened before.
Pilots sometimes think that because they fly large jets they can fly something like this too - it's actually the other way round!These older aircraft require knowledge and skill to operate safely - they bite very hard as these people found out.
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Eric Janson
- Posts: 412
- Joined: Tue Jul 14, 2015 10:31 am
New photos have emerged that clearly show both rudder and elevators did not have control locks on them.
That leaves mishandling of the aircraft which the crash video clearly shows.
If you are going to crash this is the aircraft to be in - built like a tank.
That leaves mishandling of the aircraft which the crash video clearly shows.
If you are going to crash this is the aircraft to be in - built like a tank.
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Colonel
- Posts: 3450
- Joined: Wed Apr 29, 2015 10:31 am
[quote][b]mishandling of the aircraft[/b] which the crash video clearly shows[/quote]
But you and I know, that's not the way it's going to be spun.
Instead, the narrative will be pushed that the -3 is a [b]Fire Breathing Dragon[/b]
which can only be flown by superheroes with close regulator oversight.
Jesus, this shit makes me throw up. A perfectly good airplane, trashed.
But you and I know, that's not the way it's going to be spun.
Instead, the narrative will be pushed that the -3 is a [b]Fire Breathing Dragon[/b]
which can only be flown by superheroes with close regulator oversight.
Jesus, this shit makes me throw up. A perfectly good airplane, trashed.
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ScudRunner-d95
- Posts: 1349
- Joined: Thu Feb 13, 2014 5:08 pm
Ive been to "Burn it" many times and yes thats how a real Texan pronounces it.
If your in the neighborhood drive up to Llano and hit Coopers BBQ pit, got the meat sweats just thinking about it.
If your in the neighborhood drive up to Llano and hit Coopers BBQ pit, got the meat sweats just thinking about it.
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Liquid Charlie
- Posts: 524
- Joined: Sun Aug 23, 2015 1:34 pm
That aircraft was either hugely overloaded or possibly at a high altitude airport or there was not T/O power selected, a very famous airline I know used METO power for takeoff - a good M/T DC3 will fly at about 45 to 50 kts but never do any control inputs (especially ailerons) but even elevators, this guy got the wings "walking" and that was the end of it. I actually have bounced DC3's off reefs on skies to get them to accelerate in sticky snow conditions. Once you got her bouncing it would accelerate every time it left the ground and at about 50 kts hang there and slowly pull its self out and go flying. At any point if there was a hick up it was pull the power and put it back on the ground - I think some one mentioned or alluded to V speeds - none I ever used for a piston 3 I think 80kts was the go flying speed but depending on load shit can one right then with the gear hanging chances are you are landing straight ahead.
To bad the video quality is poor but when he leveled the wings and then scraped the wing tip it looked like a lot of aileron being used.
To bad the video quality is poor but when he leveled the wings and then scraped the wing tip it looked like a lot of aileron being used.
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Eric Janson
- Posts: 412
- Joined: Tue Jul 14, 2015 10:31 am
Preliminary NTSB report
[url=https://www.ntsb.gov/_layouts/ntsb.avia ... 0721X41413]https://www.ntsb.gov/_layouts/ntsb.avia ... 0721X41413[/url]
Not sure why you'd tell someone not to bring the tail up - helps with directional control and prevents the aircraft getting airborne too early and at too low a speed. DC-3 101.
Prevents exactly what happened to them.
Really have to question how these Pilots were trained.
[url=https://www.ntsb.gov/_layouts/ntsb.avia ... 0721X41413]https://www.ntsb.gov/_layouts/ntsb.avia ... 0721X41413[/url]
Not sure why you'd tell someone not to bring the tail up - helps with directional control and prevents the aircraft getting airborne too early and at too low a speed. DC-3 101.
Prevents exactly what happened to them.
Really have to question how these Pilots were trained.