Use of power when landing.

[John Swallow]

"...800 feet short of an 8,000 foot runway at CYHM?"

But, you gotta admit he was determined!  (;>0)

[Slick Goodlin]

[quote author=Chuck Ellsworth link=topic=7583.msg20974#msg20974 date=1512418317]
Do you use power all the way to touch down[/quote]
Airplanes that don't call for it - no.


Airplanes that do call for it - yes.


So Cubs and ultralights and whatnot, the floaty stuff with little propellers, don't need to be landed with power and I'm a fan of doing very big slips down over the trees before plunking them down so power goes against how I operate them.  Planes with huge props (relatively) and lots of blades and the ability to basically close like shutters at idle seem to prefer landing at zero thrust, which is a power setting just a hair above idle.  I know what number I'm looking for on the gauge, but I can also feel on final if I've crossed that line and the prop has started making drag.

[Colonel]

[quote]he was determined[/quote]

Funny:  it was "determined" that the poor t-bird suffered
"landing gear failure".  That was the spin in the narrative
that the operator pushed afterwards.

I don't know of any aircraft that can be crashed short of
the runway, and expected not to sustain damage.

Yes, when an aircraft is crashed, you can expect the landing
gear to be damaged, if it's extended.  Thank you, Captain
Obvious.

[JW Scud]

Is there any aircraft where one lands under normal conditions with power above idle? I guess I have come across a couple of taildraggers where a few hundred extra rpm made a wheel landing reasonable instead of bouncy?

[Liquid Charlie]

As I mentioned -- Convair 580 -- no chop and plop with that a/c

[Slick Goodlin]

[quote author=JW Scud link=topic=7583.msg21078#msg21078 date=1512836953]
Is there any aircraft where one lands under normal conditions with power above idle?
[/quote]
The MU-2 needs about 20% torque until touchdown.  Less than that and the props aren't just producing drag, they're disturbing the airflow over most of the wing.


Just a guess, but I bet this thing [i]really[/i] needs a touch of power on to land:
[img width=500 height=377]http://a397.idata.over-blog.com/600x452 ... 35--2-.jpg[/img]

[Colonel]

[quote]I have come across a couple of taildraggers where a few hundred extra rpm made a wheel landing reasonable[/quote]

You're probably coming in flat.  Try staying high longer, and
approach steeper, and you won't need any power on final
for any kind of touchdown.  Sideslip as necessary to kill
your excess energy on final so that you arrive over the
runway numbers with the desired airspeed.

As Gerry Younger says, [b]don't be power-dependent[/b], and
he's forgotten more about flying than all of us know.

Whether you have fixed-pitch prop or constant-speed
prop makes a HUGE difference, BTW, as does your idle
setting.

While the idle setting of a fixed-pitch prop is really only
noticeable after the flare - a high idle setting can really
extends the very potentially-expensive rollout - the idle
setting of a constant-speed prop makes a difference in
flight.

I actually set the idle on my Maule so low, that if you
pull the throttle back on the ground, the engine stops.
This means that in the air, on final, you can pull the
throttle all the way back and get tremendous drag from
the windmilling constant speed prop.  Allows for marvellous
control on final.  With that configuration, and full flap and
sideslip, you can be insanely high on final and approach very
steeply but still keep your airspeed low for touchdown.

Don't get me wrong, I love sideslipping more than you
will ever know, but without a slobber pot, you can dump
oil overboard with a good sideslip, and it's expensive!

Just don't use beta in flight unless you really know what
you are doing.  Wayne Handley thought he did.  Once. 
He was in the hospital for a long time after that.  It would
have killed a normal person.

Now, off to the airport!  Looks like another great weekend
for flying, abeit a tad chilly.  Must bring a sweatshirt today.

[img width=500 height=67][/img]

[Chuck Ellsworth]

Wheel landings with the throttle closed is all about using stored energy and flaring at exactly the correct height above the runway and touching down in the correct attitude.


If you can not judge wheel height above the runway accurately you will never be able to wheel land with the throttle closed and consistently do nice bounce free touch downs.


I hardly ever used any power from fifty feet to touch down in the DC3 because I just made better landings that way.

[John Swallow]

The Shrike Commander 500 and the turbine-powered Commanders were also landed with a touch of power.  (12 inches MAP for the Shrike and 10% torque for the Commander 1000, as I remember)

[Chuck Ellsworth]

The 690B had flight idle and ground idle.


Flight idle would give a really steep descent angle and I do not recall ever landing in flight idle.


By the way the 690B would be my second choice for the ultimate personal toy.


Here is my first choice.




The Shrike did real nice landings with both props feathered, Bob Hoover made it look easy.  :)