Handle Overbookings, beat the snot out of pax and drag them off.

[ScudRunner-d95]

The interwebs are going ape shit about this, I'm loving the memes


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[Liquid Charlie]

OK most think United screwed up but I'm sure that the counter and the F/A's were just following SOP. The guy had no cause to to rebel like that and he should have complied. No excuse, no argument, he should have got his walker and ambled off the aircraft.


Now moving on to the big picture. How fucked up is the system when cops beat a guy senseless but what if the guy had been drunk (maybe he had a few) younger and a thug, insulting people. Then I suspect the tune would be different. It's a sign of the times in the security biz, especially in America. They are paranoid, pure and simple. Lets not blame the airline for police brutality.


Just to enlighten a few here. Jump seating and dead heading in the US of A is a big deal. Passengers get bumped all the time for dead heading crew and even crews commuting home on their own time. It's far different than Canada that way. The last jump seat conference I was around the motto was "no pilot gets left behind" so over booking and bumping is a very common occurrence. I'm thinking that people need to grow up and get a life. Stupid shit happens. How we deal with it is the test. This guy failed!!!

[vanNostrum]

[quote author=Liquid Charlie link=topic=6023.msg15878#msg15878 date=1491881022]
The guy had no cause to to rebel like that and he should have complied.


United sold him a ticket, took his money,gave him a boarding pass with an specific seat, boarded him and then tell him
that he was randomly selected to be kick out of the plane for doing nothing wrong but of course no reason to be upset


'[size=2]'[font=verdana], he should have got his walker and ambled off the aircraft.[/font][font=verdana] ''[/font][/size]
What a patronising and A hole comment

[/quote]

[Liquid Charlie]

I'm older than this guy so I'm allowed to comment like that --  >:D  - I have dealt with and had experienced passengers like this in my career. He simply brought it on himself with a reaction that was completely off the scale. The consumer will always go after the perceived bad guy and I don't condone police brutality but why do people lose it over such a minor issue. I know any one would be pissed but to take it to such an extreme he has to accept the results. Certainly he will take this to court. It's his right. He could have done the same if he just complied. Any passenger not complying with a crew is subject to being removed from the aircraft, no matter what the reason.  Contrary to belief, captains have very little authority or control when the aeroplane is still attached to the bridge.


I think this issue is getting muddied in all the media coverage and reaction to physical abuse. In my my mind there are 2 issues here. He got bad news and reacted in a very inappropriate way. His reaction was cause for intervention. The fact he was dragged off the aeroplane leads me to believe this. The police over reacted but that's a daily happening now.


Now the policy of over-booking is not popular but pretty common practice with the majority of airlines. It's a fact of life for the travelling public. While this was a very unfortunate incident it's common on a daily basis. His behaviour was such is that he got what he deserved in this day of security paranoid mindset. If the guy had of been clutching a Qur'an and supporting head gear would there be such a reaction. The only issue I see here is behaviour and he got exactly what he wanted because of it. We can't let passengers take over in the back of an aeroplane. It violates all the training we get throughout our careers. I simply a bad person for not tolerating stupid.

[Rookie Pilot]

Liquid Charlie,


You're wrong on one important point -- the flight was not overbooked. It was fully booked, with everyone boarded and in a confirmed seat. Legally the airline can no longer force a passenger off that isn't violating any other rule, to replace with 4 crew that showed up at the last minute. He has a heck of a case. United royally screwed up and had 2 options.


A) raise the price to a level to attract 4 volunteers,
B) ground shuttle the DH crew.(was only 4 hours by road)


Airline has a duty of care, and if I was a lawyer I'd love to try it before a jury.


Where was the Captain on that flight? Jet bridge or not no way if it was my airplane that would have happened.


I can't believe how gutless some are dealing with their own company. I would have said no way, fire me.  That's who I am.


I wouldn't have argued as the pax that never works out. But united is 100% responsible here. No excuses.

[David MacRay]

~shrug~

They were the only other star alliance member that treated us noticeably and significantly worse than Air Canada. One of the flights we were on were, Air Canada flight xxx operated by United.

On our over booked flight they started the bidding at $50 voucher, no hotel while you waited for the next flight. It did not get much better before they found volunteers. They saved weight by leaving most of our luggage behind for later flights

Fortunately we were home her so we just waited until they "found" our things a few days later. Only carrier to break things too.

Real shocking, ~yawn~

[Slick Goodlin]

A golden marketing opportunity for everyone else...
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[Pittsartist]

What I dont understand (as a Brit) is why the hell people accept overbookings at all ?


After all, you bought a ticket, paid for it in full - so why should you accept that the airline can sell more seats than they have ? After all - they get paid even if you dont put your bum on the seat you paid for dont they ?


Wouldnt accept it from British Airways, stiff upper lip and all that ..................

[Liquid Charlie]

Obviously this guy didn't accept it and look what happened to him -- well rookie ya know I would expect you would be looking for a job then. What would that prove. I'm not saying the incident was right or even acceptable but the passenger's behaviour was out of control and we saw the results. Maturity dictates you choose your ground where to fight your battles. He obviously reacted to a degree that in some cases would call for a session on a couch. How can anyone accept his reaction as normal, unless that is now the norm of today -- damn -- it's the way of doing business for many years since the demand for cheap no frills airfares. If I understand what you are saying the dead heading crew is just following orders and it was up to who ever was in charge of the ticket counter to sort out the problem. In this case a captain can not dictate who stays on gets off his aircraft if it's a commercial decision. What he ended up with is an unruly passenger and then his course of action is set -- "get the fucker off my aircraft" no matter what caused the problem in the first place. I will also lay odds that the flight crew was only aware that there was an issue with the number of passengers and not even involved until the meltdown in the back. There is just too much going on for front end crew to be even worried or involved in what was going on during the the boarding process. It's great for everyone to get on their soap box and call fowl. Maybe there is a valid complaint but there is no excuse for the escalation. He could possibly find himself on the "no fly" list for his psychotic behaviour. Possibly from the reaction and posts here there would be others joining him under the same circumstances -- blows me away. I always work under the philosophy that one "slides father on bull shit than course gravel" - there is always a rational way of approaching things and throwing a tantrum isn't one of them. I have no idea where he was going but likely to a destination serviced by more than one carrier. Like I said man up and deal with it. To be carrier off an aircraft like a piece of blubber is not be very mature or even smart. That's my issue. I am not even judging the policy or the events that lead up to the drama. I am only making the point he made his bed and then he had to lay in it. I wonder what he is like on the road -- scary thought -- too many like him out there and flying commercially seems to bring people out of the closet.

[Rookie Pilot]

Charlie,


I haven't had a job in 20 years, and my last job I used to routinely shoot off my opinion to my boss. That's allowed when one is a top producer.


Yeah, I'd probably get fired pretty quick, today. I don't tolerate stupidity much.


I get your comments and I don't argue with police, TSA ect. I Value my face.  I'd get off.


But this CEO of United is a total dick and the airline screwed this so "yuge".