[quote author=Chuck Ellsworth link=topic=5879.msg15533#msg15533 date=1490210481]
As I said, I can not remember every note in every POH I have ever read.
My position on the use of flaps is quite simple.
Sitting here thinking about the far distant past when I flew those simple basic trainers. ( Cessna trainers like the ones you listed ) I can not recall ever having a problem with slipping with flaps extended.
So I guess I am ignorant.
There feel better now?
[/quote]
Aren't we discussing engine operation on this thread?
Some more thoughts on training.
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Chuck Ellsworth
[quote]Aren't we discussing engine operation on this thread?[/quote]
The thread is about my thoughts on flight training and the different bad habits, poor aircraft handling I have seen when I was doing advanced flight training.
I am only commenting on my own personal experience in flight training.
I am not insinuating that I am better than anyone else, what I am writing about is aircraft handling that I personally see as sloppy or just plain not acceptable in the world I flew in.
Anyhow if this is a dick measuring contest you would like to get in here is a fair question.
What was the most money you ever made in a short period of time, as in less than a month?
My best was $45,000.00 USD for just over fifteen hours in two weeks.
The thread is about my thoughts on flight training and the different bad habits, poor aircraft handling I have seen when I was doing advanced flight training.
I am only commenting on my own personal experience in flight training.
I am not insinuating that I am better than anyone else, what I am writing about is aircraft handling that I personally see as sloppy or just plain not acceptable in the world I flew in.
Anyhow if this is a dick measuring contest you would like to get in here is a fair question.
What was the most money you ever made in a short period of time, as in less than a month?
My best was $45,000.00 USD for just over fifteen hours in two weeks.
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mcrit
[quote author=JW Scud link=topic=5879.msg15505#msg15505 date=1490167745]
Bottom line, 1000 rpm is a good target and occasional braking may be an acceptable trade-off.
[/quote]
[b]NO! [size=12pt]NO![/size] [size=18pt]NO![/size][/b]
Power against brakes is the [i]least[/i] desirable way to control speed. That is a set up for hot brakes with the associated brake fade and tire blow outs. That is a horrible habit to instill in a student, and I'm getting tired of having to break it in mine.
1000 RPM is a guideline, it is a [i]should[/i]. That means that you can have the engine idling at a lower RPM if you have a good reason. Controlling your taxi speed and avoiding hot brakes is a good reason for a lower RPM. When you are stopped and holding short, bring the RPM back up to 1000.
Bottom line, 1000 rpm is a good target and occasional braking may be an acceptable trade-off.
[/quote]
[b]NO! [size=12pt]NO![/size] [size=18pt]NO![/size][/b]
Power against brakes is the [i]least[/i] desirable way to control speed. That is a set up for hot brakes with the associated brake fade and tire blow outs. That is a horrible habit to instill in a student, and I'm getting tired of having to break it in mine.
1000 RPM is a guideline, it is a [i]should[/i]. That means that you can have the engine idling at a lower RPM if you have a good reason. Controlling your taxi speed and avoiding hot brakes is a good reason for a lower RPM. When you are stopped and holding short, bring the RPM back up to 1000.
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Chuck Ellsworth
As we both know it is difficult to change someones way of doing things, especially things that are taught wrong mcrit.
When I started this thread outlining a few bad airplane handling methods I have observed the first one I mentioned is the use of brakes and no reduction in power while taxiing.
As we can see the problem is still there and is still defended by some who seem to be flight instructors.
But we will keep on trying to point out where they are lacking in teaching skills because as experienced teachers our first challenge is to erase ignorance.
When I started this thread outlining a few bad airplane handling methods I have observed the first one I mentioned is the use of brakes and no reduction in power while taxiing.
As we can see the problem is still there and is still defended by some who seem to be flight instructors.
But we will keep on trying to point out where they are lacking in teaching skills because as experienced teachers our first challenge is to erase ignorance.
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Rookie Pilot
- Posts: 404
- Joined: Tue Sep 08, 2015 1:44 am
[quote author=mcrit link=topic=5879.msg15540#msg15540 date=1490215289]
[quote author=JW Scud link=topic=5879.msg15505#msg15505 date=1490167745]
Bottom line, 1000 rpm is a good target and occasional braking may be an acceptable trade-off.
[/quote]
[b]NO! [size=12pt]NO![/size] [size=18pt]NO![/size][/b]
Power against brakes is the [i]least[/i] desirable way to control speed. That is a set up for hot brakes with the associated brake fade and tire blow outs. That is a horrible habit to instill in a student, and I'm getting tired of having to break it in mine.
1000 RPM is a guideline, it is a [i]should[/i]. That means that you can have the engine idling at a lower RPM if you have a good reason. Controlling your taxi speed and avoiding hot brakes is a good reason for a lower RPM. When you are stopped and holding short, bring the RPM back up to 1000.
[/quote]
Exactly. Not in any aircraft of mine you wouldn't be heating up the brakes like that, banging down a bumpy taxiway at Mach 1. Risk a loss of control, too, while trying to do the checklist while moving, I'm betting.
Anything for the ham fisted club to save 0.1 on the rental Hobbs meter, which is the real reason people taxi fast. Nothing like giving a shit about the engine or anything else on the plane. Not buying.
Glad I don't run a flight school and deal with some of the infantile shit I've seen some rental pilots do.
[quote author=JW Scud link=topic=5879.msg15505#msg15505 date=1490167745]
Bottom line, 1000 rpm is a good target and occasional braking may be an acceptable trade-off.
[/quote]
[b]NO! [size=12pt]NO![/size] [size=18pt]NO![/size][/b]
Power against brakes is the [i]least[/i] desirable way to control speed. That is a set up for hot brakes with the associated brake fade and tire blow outs. That is a horrible habit to instill in a student, and I'm getting tired of having to break it in mine.
1000 RPM is a guideline, it is a [i]should[/i]. That means that you can have the engine idling at a lower RPM if you have a good reason. Controlling your taxi speed and avoiding hot brakes is a good reason for a lower RPM. When you are stopped and holding short, bring the RPM back up to 1000.
[/quote]
Exactly. Not in any aircraft of mine you wouldn't be heating up the brakes like that, banging down a bumpy taxiway at Mach 1. Risk a loss of control, too, while trying to do the checklist while moving, I'm betting.
Anything for the ham fisted club to save 0.1 on the rental Hobbs meter, which is the real reason people taxi fast. Nothing like giving a shit about the engine or anything else on the plane. Not buying.
Glad I don't run a flight school and deal with some of the infantile shit I've seen some rental pilots do.
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Chuck Ellsworth
Well rookie running a flight school was mind boggling trying to deal with some of the stupidity that has become ingrained in the system, and to make it even worse TC allows it.
Like I said previously the miss treatment of the brakes while taxiing was rampant among the instructors.
[i]I had a couple who were trainable so I put them to work in the hangar replacing brakes and a few other things, a few got it and I put them back to work instructing. [/i]
[i]A few refused to work in the hangar so I let them go.[/i]
Like I said previously the miss treatment of the brakes while taxiing was rampant among the instructors.
[i]I had a couple who were trainable so I put them to work in the hangar replacing brakes and a few other things, a few got it and I put them back to work instructing. [/i]
[i]A few refused to work in the hangar so I let them go.[/i]
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Rookie Pilot
- Posts: 404
- Joined: Tue Sep 08, 2015 1:44 am
Chuck,
This stuff isn't TC's fault. It's called spoiled little kids who whined to their baby boomer MOMMY and DADDY after getting their noses and arse wiped at the age of 21, demanded mommy and daddy pay for them to learn to become Flight Instructors so they could assume attitude city over everyone, while refusing to sweep a floor or clean an oil spot.
Why, this is the group who whines incessantly on Av Can on why they aren't worth 100K per year as a 200 hr wonder, because they've been coddled their whole life.
It's a shock when they have to deal with business owners like me who tear them a new one for their entitled attitude. New MBA,s are the same if not worse, BTW.
I started working odd paid jobs at 11, real job at 15, started first company at 18. Out of the house for good at 18.
Not many little today's brats could handle that. Be looking for the "safe place".
This is what our society is built on. What a rude shock is coming one day for them.
This stuff isn't TC's fault. It's called spoiled little kids who whined to their baby boomer MOMMY and DADDY after getting their noses and arse wiped at the age of 21, demanded mommy and daddy pay for them to learn to become Flight Instructors so they could assume attitude city over everyone, while refusing to sweep a floor or clean an oil spot.
Why, this is the group who whines incessantly on Av Can on why they aren't worth 100K per year as a 200 hr wonder, because they've been coddled their whole life.
It's a shock when they have to deal with business owners like me who tear them a new one for their entitled attitude. New MBA,s are the same if not worse, BTW.
I started working odd paid jobs at 11, real job at 15, started first company at 18. Out of the house for good at 18.
Not many little today's brats could handle that. Be looking for the "safe place".
This is what our society is built on. What a rude shock is coming one day for them.
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Chuck Ellsworth
Flight training is regulated by Transport Canada.
If Transport Canada were doing their jobs these instructors who are not teaching properly would be identified in the PPL students final flight test results.
Assuming of course the flight test examiners are competent and are doing the job their position requires.
So, yes TC is responsible.
If Transport Canada were doing their jobs these instructors who are not teaching properly would be identified in the PPL students final flight test results.
Assuming of course the flight test examiners are competent and are doing the job their position requires.
So, yes TC is responsible.
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Chuck Ellsworth
You are correct Rookie, far to many of today's generation believe they are entitled.
But it started a long time ago.
I recall one instructor who answered my add for a class 4 instructor.
He had just finished his rating and my school was his first job application.
So I sat him down and explained what would be required of him.
First the job paid a base pay plus a per flight hour flying pay and ground instruction pay.
Also he would be assigned an airplane that was his responsibility to do a daily inspection on.
The inspection would include making sure the airplane was clean inside and out side and ensure the fuel and oil were sufficient to start the day., if it needed fuel or oil it was his responsibility to put it in the airplane.
He said he was a pilot, and fueling and putting oil in the airplane was the mechanics job.
Anyhow I thanked him for applying and said it was to bad he did not meet my company requirements.
His parents threatened to sue me!!!
No wonder some kids are hopeless.
But it started a long time ago.
I recall one instructor who answered my add for a class 4 instructor.
He had just finished his rating and my school was his first job application.
So I sat him down and explained what would be required of him.
First the job paid a base pay plus a per flight hour flying pay and ground instruction pay.
Also he would be assigned an airplane that was his responsibility to do a daily inspection on.
The inspection would include making sure the airplane was clean inside and out side and ensure the fuel and oil were sufficient to start the day., if it needed fuel or oil it was his responsibility to put it in the airplane.
He said he was a pilot, and fueling and putting oil in the airplane was the mechanics job.
Anyhow I thanked him for applying and said it was to bad he did not meet my company requirements.
His parents threatened to sue me!!!
No wonder some kids are hopeless.
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Slick Goodlin
- Posts: 721
- Joined: Thu Jun 11, 2015 6:46 pm
To be fair, there's a hell of a lot of good kids out there too. More than the generation gets credit for. Those are the ones that should be targeted and those are the ones who can embarrass the others into getting better, they just need to be given the tools to do so.
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