CL604 Down Naples FL

[Slick Goodlin]

That blows to have missed lining up with the highway by *this* much. I mean it blows to have lost both engines and all that but avoiding that wall or fence or whatever could have been the pilots’ last chance to be able to walk away.

[Colonel]

That acoustic wall sure made a lot of noise.

https://www.youtube.com/results?search_ ... s+reasontv

[Eric Janson]

Would it have improved his landing?

PS The chart for the low fuel temp limits did not include time. Strange.

True - but it would reduce controller confusion. That seems to be the case every time an Emergency is declared instead of using MAYDAY.

Regarding fuel temp.

- Takes time for fuel to cool. There is no issue until you reach the minimum temperature.
- The lowest temperature the fuel will cool to is the OAT + Ram rise (TAT or Total Air Temperature). The Ram rise can easily be 20c.

It's unusual for the TAT to get close to the fuel freezing temperature - I've only seen it a handful of times.

The most extreme I've seen is flying over Siberia during COVID. This was the first and only time I've seen a warning for the trim tank in the Stabiliser. The procedure is to transfer the fuel to the main tanks which have fuel/oil heat exchangers and return flow from the Integrated Drive Generators.

Increasing the speed will increase the Ram rise and descending should increase the OAT - both can be used but it takes time to warm the fuel.

[Colonel]

What would have been the effect of idle power in the descent from FL400 on the fuel heater effectiveness?

[Nark]

I can’t talk for the 604, but for the Airbus 320 series return fuel cycled around the IDG’s (Integrated Drive Generators) typically sees temps in the 80-100* F range. Idle from FL400 probably wouldn’t inhibit heat exchange that much. (You asked about 30 minutes too late, other wise I could have snapped a pic)

Again, not a -604/CRJ rated pilot. (2 jet types I’ve flown run the same type of system)

[Nark]

I have a buddy who flies the 604. I asked him about the potential for freezing fuel, and it’s almost nil.

They don’t even add prist unless oil temps fall below 27 (I’m assuming in freedom units)

He’s flying to some shitty ski hill place in the Rockies tomorrow. I asked him to see what temps do.

[Colonel]

Oof. The other causes of double engine failure are not pretty.

Because of the incredible complexity of the Challenger fuel system, as an engineer I was suspicious of a SPOF.
Complicated sh1t breaks, sooner or later. Just a matter of time.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Single_point_of_failure

[Scudrunner]

https://data.ntsb.gov/carol-repgen/api/ ... 193769/pdf


NTSB preliminary report

[digits]

After the airplane came to rest, the cabin attendant stated that she identified that the cabin
and emergency exits were blocked by fire and coordinated the successful egress of her
passengers and herself through the baggage compartment door in the tail section of the
airplane.

Impressive. Does the CL604 have a door handle on the inside of the baggage compartment door to open the door from the inside?

[Scudrunner]

Yes it does, its sort of a plug style. Grab the handle you pull forward then it comes in and up.

You can see it in this video at the 2:20 mark.