Electric light sport airplane.

[David MacRay]

Bob Barrows designed the BearHawk planes. Here is a video interviewing him about an electric ultralight he was building. I have concluded electric planes are further off in the future than I used to think, obviously true, since I figured they would be common enough to have seen one fly in person by now. I have to look into this to find out if he ever flew the one here since the video is from a while ago.

[Scudrunner]

The only "practical" electric drive airplane will utilize a smaller fuel powered generator to produce the current for the electric engines. Other than that I don't really see them becoming more than toys or niche aircraft like Harbor Airs Beavers.

[Liquid_Charlie]

It's scientific fact. The tech is just not there. The limiting factor are the batteries. We see it in the EV sector as well. They will not sell to high percentages until the batteries give us @long@ range at a reasonable price. This means the ability to cover long unsupported travel in remote areas. Give cold temperatures, very critical, for flight, and even normal winter performance for ground vehicles.

Will the EV, EA actually come to the front line or will they be a flash in the pan when we discover the true green power. Let's face it most of any renewable power source comes with a big ticket cost. Windmills, in fucking deed, NUK is still green and far cheaper to supply. Hyro electric is not that green in it's present form because of disruption to water sheds and flooding of lands due to damming.

[Slick Goodlin]

Barrows’ electric UL is an ongoing project and I don’t think it’s complete yet. I imagine he’s a busy guy what with his Bearhawk designs being so popular. The success of his Bearhawks also leads me to believe he knows what he’s doing and it will likely meet his goals, whatever they may be.

I think the success of an electric airplane largely depends on where you put the goalposts. Right now those posts would be an airplane we’d expect to be big enough for two people but only seats one and with 45-60 minutes endurance plus reserves. That satisfies the desire to toot around a bit after dinner and honestly would cover most of the flying I enjoy. I don’t believe we’ll see electric airliners with anything near today’s technology and the regeneration seen in efficient hybrid cars is based on a cycle of acceleration and deceleration not seen in aviation so I expect that’s out too.

[Liquid_Charlie]

the regeneration seen in efficient hybrid cars is based on a cycle of acceleration and deceleration not seen in aviation so I expect that’s out too.

Hybrids are a bit of a joke and the extra cost is very hard to recover. I cornered a Toyota sales person one day and had to really hold his feet to the fire about hybrids but he finally came clean. If you do any amount of highway or free way driving the economy is the same as the city driving. A friend of mine has a rav 4 hybrid and the electric drive cuts out a 20km an hour. The also advertise it a AWD but it's not. It's front wheel drive with electric drive for the rear, which cuts out above 20km/hr -

Where I live hybrids are just not practical, EV's don't have the range and don't like the cold. I love the concept of an EV and if it could work where I live there would be one sitting out front but that's not the case. I drive a 1 ton diesel and wonder why I didn't venture past a 3/4 ton long before this. Ontario on the other hand has really stupid vehicle licensing laws and they classify it as a commercial vehicle even though it's personal use. It's only money --haha

Electric trucks will haul and trailer heavy loads but they simply do not have the legs required.

The other interesting thing I found out about the present day fast charge EV's is the fast charge cycle only charges batteries to about 50% then it cycles down to a lower charge rate.

I watch a video of a guy planning a trip from chicago to NY and his whole trip was based on fast chargers and partial battery charges and the hope of finding a fast charge station. He was charging to 25% capacity on some legs. Jeeezus I like my road trips and re-fuelling needs to be equal to 2 piss stops or between 6 and 7 hundred KM

[David MacRay]

I thought we would have light singles capable of over an hour of flight time by now.

Not practical as transportation but certainly ok for flying around the circuit. And a certain amount of training.

15 years ago it was not even close.

Lightweight speed controllers that can run a brushless alternating current motor using direct current from a battery had been developed a little under a decade ago and that was a pretty big step.

Batteries also improved, just not quite enough.

I don't see it being viable for larger aircraft for quite some time though.

[Slick Goodlin]

I thought we would have light singles capable of over an hour of flight time by now.

In aviation we tend to be pretty technologically conservative, and often for good reasons. If you push an electric drive right out to its limits then battery fires become a real concern. In a car you just pull over, get out, and call the fire department and insurance company. With a plane we may all talk a big talk about how we’d be the heroes and set it down safely somewhere but the reality is I can’t imagine anywhere scarier than in a fire in the sky.

So we’re stuck with bigger batteries then would be called for on the bleeding edge of technology and we’ll both charge and discharge them at a pace we’ll below what they’re made to handle. This both adds weight and restricts power, two things that in aviation are generally bad when we compare one plane to another.

[Scudrunner]

Until a plane can carry 4 people and gear 400nm on a charge there won't be mass adoption.
And with the limiting availability of 100LL I foresee the future of diesel powered light aircraft or small turbine conversions.

[David MacRay]

The risk of fire must be pretty low or they would not be playing with them.
I think everyone who flys agrees with your concerns about it Slick.

I believe another issue with batteries that we tend to ignore, is sometimes they seem to discharge sooner than expected.

I have been using a DeWalt leaf blower to make snow removal easier. I have been very pleased with it for a few seasons now. Every once in a while the battery goes dead much sooner than expected.

While it can be annoying that I can't finish the job, at least I don't have to find a place to land like I would if my plane became a glider.

[Liquid_Charlie]

All my power tools are battery now. Small tools dewalt and big ass ones like chain saws, lawnmowers, tree pruner and my kick ass 80V leaf blower. All my Greenworks are 80Volt and take my word for it, it makes a difference. I have a 40V and a 80V chainsaw and the big one is amazing and has an 18 in bar. The 40 V is light and easy to handle for small jobs like limbing.

Lithium-Ion batteries have certainly made a an impact in this area but are not the answer for vehicles. The EV evolution reminds me a lot of the PC computer industry during the 80's and 90's .

My first computer was a monster at the time - 20MB hard drive and 2 x51/2 floppy disks and DOS, the beauty of the command line, windows was developed for one reason, to try and prevent program sharing from one copy passed around.

A USR HST modem 1440 baud rate cost $750 dollars in the 90's , over $1300 today. Did I mention no internet, bulletin boards were it and downloading a 1MB file was a large undertaking. Hopefully the EV will find the same progression but it took computers almost 40 years to get to today's standards.