If you read my comments over the various posts, you will see that I have tried to explain where the 1000 rpm "rule" came from as it was specifically asked about. I tend to follow it for the reasons given. Prolonged idle is bad and I have shown why.
Reducing power when using brakes is reasonable. Reducing power for a prolonged period to dock is reasonable. Reducing power for a prolonged period on a slippery surface is reasonable.
Reducing to idle for a prolonged period for no reason is not.
As I mentioned earlier, it seems to be a bit of a trade-off. Having to use brakes versus maintaining 1000 rpm to prevent plug fouling/corrosion issues. You can burn of lead during the run-up but not the higher corrosion risk that was pointed out.
Some more thoughts on training.
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Chuck Ellsworth
[size=2]So we have been in agreement from the start.[/size]
[size=2][font=verdana, arial, helvetica, sans-serif]When I started this thread about the issues I have found when giving advanced [/font][font=verdana, arial, helvetica, sans-serif]training[/font][font=verdana, arial, helvetica, sans-serif] the very first on my list was not reducing power to idle when slowing down during taxi...[/font][/size]
[font=Verdana][size=small] [/size][/font]
[size=2][font=verdana, arial, helvetica, sans-serif]When I started this thread about the issues I have found when giving advanced [/font][font=verdana, arial, helvetica, sans-serif]training[/font][font=verdana, arial, helvetica, sans-serif] the very first on my list was not reducing power to idle when slowing down during taxi...[/font][/size]
[font=Verdana][size=small] [/size][/font]
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JW Scud
- Posts: 252
- Joined: Sun Aug 14, 2016 12:44 am
[quote author=Chuck Ellsworth link=topic=5879.msg15517#msg15517 date=1490201659]
[size=2]So we have been in agreement from the start.[/size]
[size=2][font=verdana, arial, helvetica, sans-serif]When I started this thread about the issues I have found when giving advanced [/font][font=verdana, arial, helvetica, sans-serif]training[/font][font=verdana, arial, helvetica, sans-serif] the very first on my list was not reducing power to idle when slowing down during taxi...[/font][/size]
[font=Verdana][size=small] [/size][/font]
[/quote]
It would appear that way and now those who wish to know, are aware of where the 1000 rpm thing came from and why it is important.
[size=2]So we have been in agreement from the start.[/size]
[size=2][font=verdana, arial, helvetica, sans-serif]When I started this thread about the issues I have found when giving advanced [/font][font=verdana, arial, helvetica, sans-serif]training[/font][font=verdana, arial, helvetica, sans-serif] the very first on my list was not reducing power to idle when slowing down during taxi...[/font][/size]
[font=Verdana][size=small] [/size][/font]
[/quote]
It would appear that way and now those who wish to know, are aware of where the 1000 rpm thing came from and why it is important.
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Chuck Ellsworth
[quote]
It would appear that way and now those who wish to know, are aware of where the 1000 rpm thing came from and why it is important.
[/quote]
However it has zero relevance to what I posted about....miss use of power when taxiing.
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JW Scud
- Posts: 252
- Joined: Sun Aug 14, 2016 12:44 am
[quote author=Chuck Ellsworth link=topic=5879.msg15524#msg15524 date=1490206498]
[quote]
It would appear that way and now those who wish to know, are aware of where the 1000 rpm thing came from and why it is important.
[/quote]
However it has zero relevance to what I posted about....miss use of power when taxiing.
[/quote]
Correct. But it has 100% relevance to your question of,
[quote author=Chuck Ellsworth link=topic=5879.msg15462#msg15462 date=1490025866]
Where did the rule for 1000 RPM minimum become the norm for a power setting when taxiing?
And who decided that rule?
[/quote]
I assumed that you wanted an answer.
You're welcome
[quote]
It would appear that way and now those who wish to know, are aware of where the 1000 rpm thing came from and why it is important.
[/quote]
However it has zero relevance to what I posted about....miss use of power when taxiing.
[/quote]
Correct. But it has 100% relevance to your question of,
[quote author=Chuck Ellsworth link=topic=5879.msg15462#msg15462 date=1490025866]
Where did the rule for 1000 RPM minimum become the norm for a power setting when taxiing?
And who decided that rule?
[/quote]
I assumed that you wanted an answer.
You're welcome
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JW Scud
- Posts: 252
- Joined: Sun Aug 14, 2016 12:44 am
[quote author=Chuck Ellsworth link=topic=5879.msg15530#msg15530 date=1490209653]
Thank you??
Your snotty attitude reminds me of why I sold the flight school.
[/quote]
I might say the same thing about someone ignorant about a procedure, asking about it, being informed about it, and then responding the way you just did.
But I do appreciate your thanks.
Thank you??
Your snotty attitude reminds me of why I sold the flight school.
[/quote]
I might say the same thing about someone ignorant about a procedure, asking about it, being informed about it, and then responding the way you just did.
But I do appreciate your thanks.
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Tailwind W10
- Posts: 110
- Joined: Fri May 22, 2015 5:39 pm
[font=verdana][size=14px]"To this must add trying to hold altitude with the pitch trim."[/size][/font]
Four Bars, I hope you'll allow me to nibble at this one a bit.
First of all I'm a low time pilot, so please take this in a "tell me where I'm wrong" way...
If a pilot has power set correctly for the desired airspeed in level flight, AND one is climbing and losing airspeed, would adjusting the trim not be the correct thing to do? I would certainly agree with your statement if the climb is not accompanied by speed loss, as clearly the power is not yet set correctly.
When I'm renting the Mighty 7ECA, and I transition from climb to cruise, I'll start by pushing forward on the stick, then while accelerating to speed, I'll be adjusting the trim to reduce stick force before reducing the throttle. Then i'll tweak both throttle and pitch trim to settle into the cruise parameters I want.
Is this a reasonable method?
Gerry
Four Bars, I hope you'll allow me to nibble at this one a bit.
First of all I'm a low time pilot, so please take this in a "tell me where I'm wrong" way...
If a pilot has power set correctly for the desired airspeed in level flight, AND one is climbing and losing airspeed, would adjusting the trim not be the correct thing to do? I would certainly agree with your statement if the climb is not accompanied by speed loss, as clearly the power is not yet set correctly.
When I'm renting the Mighty 7ECA, and I transition from climb to cruise, I'll start by pushing forward on the stick, then while accelerating to speed, I'll be adjusting the trim to reduce stick force before reducing the throttle. Then i'll tweak both throttle and pitch trim to settle into the cruise parameters I want.
Is this a reasonable method?
Gerry
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Chuck Ellsworth
[quote]I might say the same thing about someone ignorant about a procedure, asking about it, being informed about it, and telling you about it.[/quote]
As I said, I can not remember every note in every POH I have ever read.
My position on the use of flaps is quite simple.
Sitting here thinking about the far distant past when I flew those simple basic trainers. ( Cessna trainers like the ones you listed ) I can not recall ever having a problem with slipping with flaps extended.
So I guess I am ignorant.
There feel better now?
As I said, I can not remember every note in every POH I have ever read.
My position on the use of flaps is quite simple.
Sitting here thinking about the far distant past when I flew those simple basic trainers. ( Cessna trainers like the ones you listed ) I can not recall ever having a problem with slipping with flaps extended.
So I guess I am ignorant.
There feel better now?
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Slick Goodlin
- Posts: 721
- Joined: Thu Jun 11, 2015 6:46 pm
[quote author=Tailwind W10 link=topic=5879.msg15532#msg15532 date=1490210272]
When I'm renting the Mighty 7ECA, and I transition from climb to cruise, I'll start by pushing forward on the stick, then while accelerating to speed, I'll be adjusting the trim to reduce stick force before reducing the throttle. Then i'll tweak both throttle and pitch trim to settle into the cruise parameters I want.
Is this a reasonable method?
[/quote]
I know you didn't ask me, but yes.
When I'm teaching I want to see some strain on the student's wrist and the plane under control [i]before[/i] they reach for the elevator trim. Riding along with deviations then trying to fly on trim is just sloppy. It may keep you between the (vertical) ditches but there are better ways as you've seen. The trouble is that trim is often a fine adjustment and hard to over control so a new-ish pilot flies with trim as a crutch then never gets better.
Where this habit really gets pushed out is watching their first simulated engine failure in the overshoot (at altitude, of course) as they haven't really put any force into the controls in a long time and are scared to do so.
When I'm renting the Mighty 7ECA, and I transition from climb to cruise, I'll start by pushing forward on the stick, then while accelerating to speed, I'll be adjusting the trim to reduce stick force before reducing the throttle. Then i'll tweak both throttle and pitch trim to settle into the cruise parameters I want.
Is this a reasonable method?
[/quote]
I know you didn't ask me, but yes.
When I'm teaching I want to see some strain on the student's wrist and the plane under control [i]before[/i] they reach for the elevator trim. Riding along with deviations then trying to fly on trim is just sloppy. It may keep you between the (vertical) ditches but there are better ways as you've seen. The trouble is that trim is often a fine adjustment and hard to over control so a new-ish pilot flies with trim as a crutch then never gets better.
Where this habit really gets pushed out is watching their first simulated engine failure in the overshoot (at altitude, of course) as they haven't really put any force into the controls in a long time and are scared to do so.
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