"A bootful of rudder will be required, single engine. Although it is tempting to dial in some rudder trim, that actually reduces Vmc."
Is this just for the IA following engine failure or does this continue for the hour trip back to base? I seem to remember that the one of the actions on the twin otter was for nearly full rudder trim. (It's been a number of years... Maybe 20?)
Transitioning SE To ME
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Slick Goodlin
- Posts: 721
- Joined: Thu Jun 11, 2015 6:46 pm
Flying a twin is a blast and most of the time when everything is normal they tend to be stable and comfortable platforms made to go places. New things you may see for the first time in your multi engine conversion can include constant speed props, retractable landing gear, and a hydraulic system on the airplane so if any of those are uncharted territory for you just ask. Another change which allows some room to learn to finesse is just holding and moving two throttles. It's easy to think that if their positions match your power output will match but they almost never do so expect to feel a bit of a spread between them in the palm of your hand.
Of course, everyone always focuses on engine out procedures and performance because that's the most critical thing and will kill you pretty quickly if you botch it. It's been a while since I thought on a piston twin but I presently teach on a turboprop twin so close enough. The scenario that gets stressed a lot is the engine failure on departure because that's the one that has you boxed into the tightest corner. Think about it: you have no excess speed or altitude available, your operating engine is at max power so no power reserves either, and with gear down and some degree of flaps you're in a very high drag configuration. Life sucks when the engine quits on takeoff.
Chuck already mentioned that even though you still have one engine going on a little twin it still may not be enough to go flying today. Maybe you're flying an early Apache filled to the gills with some... curvier... ski bunnies and it's sinking no matter what, or you're in a spot very shortly after takeoff where the drag of the gear is going to pull you down and it will take longer to retract than it will to sink to the ground. Know it in advance and have a plan, but be ready to reevaluate that plan on the fly.
In my present job, once we have a positive rate of climb the decision is to go so I'll outline how I train that.
So there you are just after takeoff when all of a sudden the sound of the airplane changes and it yaws hard to one side. All plans for the day are now cancelled and your life is reduced to one job only: don't strike the ground. Controlling the airplane is job one and don't let any other task fully distract you from it. By now you've probably fed in a bunch of rudder and it's going to feel hard to do and most people wimp out at this stage. Tough. Get that skid ball in the middle, it just became leg day in the cockpit. Make sure the wings stay level(ish) and aim for whatever pitch angle works in your airplane. Don't get slow. Next up you want to climb. Give it max power while still keeping that ball in the middle and the wings level. Now reduce drag because drag is stealing potential climb rate from you. Different airplanes do this in different orders but eventually you'll have the gear and flaps up and the dead engine secured. Double check the engine you're about to feather. The vital actions will probably say something like Identify and Verify: you identify through control inputs (dead foot, dead engine) and verify with some other means. Those Trans Asia guys missed "verify" and paid the price. I think we used to close the throttle on the dead side and if nothing changed we knew we guessed right and could feather that side. Once the drag is reduced and you're climbing away at your Vyse (blue line) you can trim the plane and fly up to a safe altitude before proceeding. Time is no longer as critical so no need to rush now as you run through the shut down checks and decide where to land and call ATC to tell them. The hard part is behind you so just relax so you can think clearly and plan rationally. Look at the bright side, you've just doubled your endurance!
Hope that helps some, I always find it's nice to have a few perspectives.
Of course, everyone always focuses on engine out procedures and performance because that's the most critical thing and will kill you pretty quickly if you botch it. It's been a while since I thought on a piston twin but I presently teach on a turboprop twin so close enough. The scenario that gets stressed a lot is the engine failure on departure because that's the one that has you boxed into the tightest corner. Think about it: you have no excess speed or altitude available, your operating engine is at max power so no power reserves either, and with gear down and some degree of flaps you're in a very high drag configuration. Life sucks when the engine quits on takeoff.
Chuck already mentioned that even though you still have one engine going on a little twin it still may not be enough to go flying today. Maybe you're flying an early Apache filled to the gills with some... curvier... ski bunnies and it's sinking no matter what, or you're in a spot very shortly after takeoff where the drag of the gear is going to pull you down and it will take longer to retract than it will to sink to the ground. Know it in advance and have a plan, but be ready to reevaluate that plan on the fly.
In my present job, once we have a positive rate of climb the decision is to go so I'll outline how I train that.
So there you are just after takeoff when all of a sudden the sound of the airplane changes and it yaws hard to one side. All plans for the day are now cancelled and your life is reduced to one job only: don't strike the ground. Controlling the airplane is job one and don't let any other task fully distract you from it. By now you've probably fed in a bunch of rudder and it's going to feel hard to do and most people wimp out at this stage. Tough. Get that skid ball in the middle, it just became leg day in the cockpit. Make sure the wings stay level(ish) and aim for whatever pitch angle works in your airplane. Don't get slow. Next up you want to climb. Give it max power while still keeping that ball in the middle and the wings level. Now reduce drag because drag is stealing potential climb rate from you. Different airplanes do this in different orders but eventually you'll have the gear and flaps up and the dead engine secured. Double check the engine you're about to feather. The vital actions will probably say something like Identify and Verify: you identify through control inputs (dead foot, dead engine) and verify with some other means. Those Trans Asia guys missed "verify" and paid the price. I think we used to close the throttle on the dead side and if nothing changed we knew we guessed right and could feather that side. Once the drag is reduced and you're climbing away at your Vyse (blue line) you can trim the plane and fly up to a safe altitude before proceeding. Time is no longer as critical so no need to rush now as you run through the shut down checks and decide where to land and call ATC to tell them. The hard part is behind you so just relax so you can think clearly and plan rationally. Look at the bright side, you've just doubled your endurance!
Hope that helps some, I always find it's nice to have a few perspectives.
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Liquid Charlie
- Posts: 524
- Joined: Sun Aug 23, 2015 1:34 pm
It's all good information and it's been hinted but the reality is that light piston twins can and will bite you and are likely one of the most dangerous aircraft to fly because of minimal single engine performance. I have been indirect witness to this on 2 occasions and there were no survivors, both cases on beech 18, one on floats and one on wheels. I have also seen first had a document of a PA31 operator who had in the span of 3 months with 2 accidents and 18 lost souls. Their new procedure to combat this was any engine failure below 1000 ft was to retard the good engine and land straight ahead, sound familiar for a single engine aircraft. Runway return was disussed here and I think 800 feet is "expected" but some claim 500 feet is good enough if you are sharp. You won't necessarily get that type of performance for a return at gross in a cabin class twin. So when I read through all this they operate the twin like a single. On floats I can dig it but IFR on wheels and paying passengers -- that has me scratching my head a little -- piston twins and keeping loads a little on the light side are a treat and fun to fly - working them commercially should be disallowed --
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vanNostrum
- Posts: 338
- Joined: Wed Nov 04, 2015 9:04 pm
[font=verdana]'[size=2]'Hope that helps some, I always find it's nice to have a few perspectives.''[/size][/font]
[font=verdana]
Considering the knowledge and experience of the people postings [/font]
[font=verdana]I think I got mt money's worth[/font] :)
[font=verdana]
Considering the knowledge and experience of the people postings [/font]
[font=verdana]I think I got mt money's worth[/font] :)
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dirtdr
- Posts: 61
- Joined: Mon Aug 22, 2016 6:22 pm
Expect an engine failure on every takeoff. If it doesn't happen, consider yourself lucky and go fly.
I have had the pleasure of landing my 310 with one feathered on three separate occasions. Every time I elected to shut it down on my own (i'm glad the decision wasn't forced on me, yet).
The scariest was on a dark night leaving YQF a little after midnight. Dark. I took off and once I was clear of the lights of the runway and airport (black hole in front and beside me), I noticed what looked like flames coming from my right engine nacelle. I was about 250ft off the ground. I still had full power coming from both engines, gear and flaps were up. I elected to keep going to 500agl before doing anything. At that point I started to slowly pull engine power back on the right side while watching to see if the flames changed or decreased. They did. Still shooting out, but less with engine at idle. At this point, I am climbing at 300ft per minute (I was light - mabee 600lbs under gross), and still have the right engine windmilling at idle, so I shut her down and feather it while continuing to climb runway heading to a comfortable altitude - I ended up getting to about 1500agl before turning around (to the left). The (flames) quit all together as soon as the prop stopped turning. Somewhere along the line I declared and emergency and stated to FSS that I was turning around for immediate landing. I did so uneventfully, and even managed to taxi off the runway and to my mechanics shop (although traveling faster than I normally would have to make a couple left hand turns).
The whole event was over within a couple minutes of when it started, but it felt like closer to an hour. I remember everything happening like it was in slow motion.
After landing and shutting everything down, I was able to have a look inside the right nacelle. Alternator was all black. it turns out that a bearing in the alternator crapped out and the internal parts of the alternator were grinding on each other making a shower of sparks shoot out of the gaps in the nacelle covers. It ended up being an easy fix (replaced alternator)
I have had the pleasure of landing my 310 with one feathered on three separate occasions. Every time I elected to shut it down on my own (i'm glad the decision wasn't forced on me, yet).
The scariest was on a dark night leaving YQF a little after midnight. Dark. I took off and once I was clear of the lights of the runway and airport (black hole in front and beside me), I noticed what looked like flames coming from my right engine nacelle. I was about 250ft off the ground. I still had full power coming from both engines, gear and flaps were up. I elected to keep going to 500agl before doing anything. At that point I started to slowly pull engine power back on the right side while watching to see if the flames changed or decreased. They did. Still shooting out, but less with engine at idle. At this point, I am climbing at 300ft per minute (I was light - mabee 600lbs under gross), and still have the right engine windmilling at idle, so I shut her down and feather it while continuing to climb runway heading to a comfortable altitude - I ended up getting to about 1500agl before turning around (to the left). The (flames) quit all together as soon as the prop stopped turning. Somewhere along the line I declared and emergency and stated to FSS that I was turning around for immediate landing. I did so uneventfully, and even managed to taxi off the runway and to my mechanics shop (although traveling faster than I normally would have to make a couple left hand turns).
The whole event was over within a couple minutes of when it started, but it felt like closer to an hour. I remember everything happening like it was in slow motion.
After landing and shutting everything down, I was able to have a look inside the right nacelle. Alternator was all black. it turns out that a bearing in the alternator crapped out and the internal parts of the alternator were grinding on each other making a shower of sparks shoot out of the gaps in the nacelle covers. It ended up being an easy fix (replaced alternator)
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John Swallow
- Posts: 319
- Joined: Fri Jun 03, 2016 1:58 pm
"Expect an engine failure on every takeoff. If it doesn't happen, consider yourself lucky and go fly."
True words. However, in a five decade career, I only had one engine failure. And that was in a SE aircraft.
We parted company shortly after... (;>0)
I was lucky.
True words. However, in a five decade career, I only had one engine failure. And that was in a SE aircraft.
We parted company shortly after... (;>0)
I was lucky.
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Colonel
- Posts: 3450
- Joined: Wed Apr 29, 2015 10:31 am
Engine failures aren't always exactly like you are taught
in flight training.
A while back, a friend of mine was taking off in his twin
Cessna after some hideously expensive maintenance,
and the AME hadn't put the right engine back together
quite right, and it geysered oil after takeoff.
What to do?
Well, he immediately landed. Didn't feather it - gauges
looked good. A few quarts of oil looked impressive on
the cowling but there was enough to keep it running.
So many lessons there. Like the dangers of maintenance,
and not shutting an engine down while it's still making
power.
The problem is, you don't know exactly what's broken
until [b]after[/b] you land. In the air, you're just guessing,
and hoping that you guessed right.
You guys probably wouldn't like my friend very much
that was flying the twin Cessna, but he's one hell of
a natural pilot. I didn't think natural pilots existed
until I met him. Oh, and then one other guy after
him.
I've met two natural pilots in my lifetime. They
can do shit that would kill a normal person.
in flight training.
A while back, a friend of mine was taking off in his twin
Cessna after some hideously expensive maintenance,
and the AME hadn't put the right engine back together
quite right, and it geysered oil after takeoff.
What to do?
Well, he immediately landed. Didn't feather it - gauges
looked good. A few quarts of oil looked impressive on
the cowling but there was enough to keep it running.
So many lessons there. Like the dangers of maintenance,
and not shutting an engine down while it's still making
power.
The problem is, you don't know exactly what's broken
until [b]after[/b] you land. In the air, you're just guessing,
and hoping that you guessed right.
You guys probably wouldn't like my friend very much
that was flying the twin Cessna, but he's one hell of
a natural pilot. I didn't think natural pilots existed
until I met him. Oh, and then one other guy after
him.
I've met two natural pilots in my lifetime. They
can do shit that would kill a normal person.